Posts From The Desert - MOVIEVERSE

[dexfarkin]

A little subsection of a group of notions that have recently been noted on my earlier post about the CBFFAs. It's a minor little thought that has occured to me, and seeing as my little exile is all about exploring those thoughts, I am going to run with it.

I wonder why the idea exists that X-Men Movieverse is a ghetto of the comic book fanfiction community. Some of the major early work in that community was done by people who were big on the comicfic side of the fence. There is a fair amount of cross-over involved. Yet, it seems that a large number of exclusively movieverse writers feel as if they're advancing against a storm of hatred; modern martyrs of fanfiction.

It puzzles me because I didn't know that any of us comic book fanfiction writers were supposed to hate Movieverse fic until someone told me that I did.

When Movieverse first came out, the overall opinion of the community was that the movie was damn good. I took forty-five people to see it during DexCon. (Side note: Funniest movie comments ever provided in a packed theatre by Speedy Paul. "Ah just kissed him and he was in a coma for eight months." "Cause she's just that good!" and "Senator Kelly is dead." "On the plus side, if anyone's thirsty...") However, the opinion on reading fic about it was lukewarm at best. Some, like Dyce and Kielle looked forward to it. Others, like myself, really didn't care.

It was a good movie. It was about the best adaption of the X-Men to the big screen you could hope for, while still retaining their personalities. But they were still X-Men Lite. Two hours verses forty years? I'll take my comic canon.

That seemed to be the end of the issue. The Movieverse grew (exponentially) and drew in some comic writers. It also started with some people who crossed over later. However, in general, it seemed to be it's own community, with it's own stars and issues and ideas.

The Rogue/Logan debate was the first real spill-over that I noted. The idea of their's as a sexual relationship was treated by most comic writers with the same mindset that they approached Logan/Kitty and Logan/Jubilee relationships. Some were huge fans of it. That distaste seemed to rankle the L/R people (shippers, guild, community? I'm not sure the word) which touched off the first cross-community argument. Even that was considered by most comic writers, including myself, as an off-handed little argument in a corner. Obviously, it was not considered in the same light by the L/R writers.

Then came the CBFFAs. I'm not going to get into the logistics, suffice to say that I made the significant error in not barring them or throwing the doors wide open right off the bat. My vague 'gentlemen's agreement' idea led to a lot of ill feeling. This was compounded by a very unfortunate element of the Movieverse community who felt they had the right to demand their own categories, and threaten the integrity of the awards if not appeased. (The Best Serious-Logan/Rogue, Best Humourous-Logan/Rogue and my favourite, Best Erotic-Logan/Rogue were the main demands) Talk about tarring the entire community with the same brush. Completely devalued the opinions of the Movieverse in one stroke. The sheer volume and viciousness of the attacks left me raw to the far more reasonable voices of Naomi and Minisinoo.

Even after all that, I don't hate the Movieverse. However, it still doesn't interest me all that much. Again, X-Men Lite. I realise that there are many fine writers involved and producing likely some exceptional work. Still, I'm not very interested in it. Same reason I don't read much Batman fanfiction. Don't care. Characters don't interest me.

My sojourn into Movieverse is because the exploration of Doctor Jean Grey fascinates me, and I get to do horrible things to Mister Sinister. Even writing it, I'm still not all that interested in the characters. They feel less real to me than thier comic canon versions.

Which brings me to the question: Is this why Movieverse fanfic writers feel ghettozied? (Or if they don't, is this why Victoria P feels ghettozied?) Is it because they get disinterest about their work, while a new comic fanfiction story receives interest?

I'm rather curious on this, mostly because after reading the past posts on the X-Men Movieverse list, most of the struggles seem to be between seperate bodies of Movieverse writers arguing about interpretation, or the ever present 'Logan/Rogue' question. A wash of comic fanfic writer's posting negative protrayels of Movieverse wasn't amoungst that.

Perhaps there's an idea that Movieverse should be interchangable with comicverse, on an archival level, which has not happened to a large extent. Or perhaps that disinterest is taken as a personal rejection as a writer. Or is it that even though you're writing about a movie property of a comic book, you feel the characters and concepts should be interchangable?

Anyhow, feel free to elighten me. If you're a Movieverse writer and feel like you've been relegated to a second class citizen by comic book fanfiction, explain why that is. This is not a trial or a place for justifications. I'm honestly curious why the feeling exists, and in what ways you feel it's manifested on a regular basis. Enlighten me.

Comments

[musesfool.livejournal.com]

My "whatever" was actually more directed at her than at you. And I like her, so it isn't that. But I do feel that fans at large, movieverse and others, are much too fond of victimizing themselves. And that I *have* noticed.

Oh yeah, there's no lack of martyrs or masters of passive-aggressive behavior in fandom. I prefer not to use those tactics, and if I'm coming across that way, that's not my intention at all.

Dex asked for opinions and I gave mine, along with my impressions.

However, being labeled a shitty writer or a pedophile based on nothing more than one's chosen pairing becomes wearing after a while.

And yes, it has happened to me, and to others, and I don't think either is applicable to me (or to the others).

I think it might have something to do with the fact that movieverse writers are more interested in comic stories than the other way around. And I think that's natural, really. For us, any interpretation, including comics, is valid. For you, not so much.

That's true, but I also think that the overwhelming amount of X-canon simply baffles many movieverse writers and really, unless one gets into the comics, fic about Dazzler or Marrow isn't going to be of interest to most movieverse fans. Nor are the more action-based, less-romance type of stories, because, as trite as it sounds, if I wanted that, I'd read the comics.

Strangely, the freedom from thirty years of canon afforded me by the X-Men movie has not carried over into my Smallville writing, and I can't seem to shake the shadow of Superman as iconic figure, and rewrite Smallville's future to feature a happy ending for Clark and Lex, though the romantic in me would like to.

Re:

[kattahj.livejournal.com]

I just realised I should probably go read some fic about Marrow. *wide grin*

So, is this about comicverse writers' attitudes to movieverse, or non L/R-ers' attitudes to LR/-ers? Because I do believe there is quite a considerable difference. I'm more than willing to admit that I have prejudice against L/R and that it will take a lot of effort from the writer's side to make me like it. That certainly doesn't make me comicsverse.

[musesfool.livejournal.com]

I just realised I should probably go read some fic about Marrow. *wide grin*

The only ones I've read are by Janete, but hot *damn*...

Ahem.

And I'm not even a big femslash fan.

So, is this about comicverse writers' attitudes to movieverse, or non L/R-ers' attitudes to LR/-ers? Because I do believe there is quite a considerable difference. I'm more than willing to admit that I have prejudice against L/R and that it will take a lot of effort from the writer's side to make me like it. That certainly doesn't make me comicsverse.

There's a perception that quite often, anything movieverse is dismissed because it's automatically *assumed* (and you know what assuming does, eh?) to be L/R. About which then there is a second assumption that L/R is crap. Therefore, the faulty logic of movieverse=L/R=crap comes into play, and *that's* what I'm talking about.

You don't like a pairing, that's not my problem. I don't like certain pairings and won't read them - I wouldn't tar all the fic written about them with the same brush, nor would I exclude a whole genre from my reading list simply because I thought that because fic about X pairing was crap, so the whole genre must be crap.

And I speak from experience on this. My first exposure to internet media fanfiction was back in 1998 and it was an absolutely atrocious (in a scary way) Buffy/Angel reunion after Becoming fic.

I didn't read fanfic again for almost a year based on the sheer badness and horror of that one story. I decided all fanfic must be crap.

I've since learned differently.

The L/R vs. anti-L/R within movieverse is a whole different kettle of fish.

Re:

[kattahj.livejournal.com]

Well, it's quite possible that I've never had much of a problem with comicsverse attitude because I *dont* write L/R. Or it could be because I just don't hang with enough comicsverse people to give a damn what they say of movieverse. But of all the things I've heard comicsverse people say of movieverse, I don't think I've heard anyone claim it was all L/R. I've heard plenty of early movieversers call it "the pairing that ate fandom", though.

[musesfool.livejournal.com]

Well, the comicversers I speak to (via LJ anyway) on a semi-regular basis are the ones who *don't* give me the vibe that they have a problem with movieverse, so I can't say I hang out with any comicverse authors who evince this kind of attitude (though Alara and I have gone a few rounds on the subject, I don't think she thinks that movieverse=bad. I just like to argue and think there was definitely room for debate in her comments on the subject and I hope she's taken them in that spirit, rather than as some sort of personal thing *g*). And I think that the early movieversers who talked about L/R as the "pairing that ate fandom" were the writers who came from comicverse.

I could be wrong about that.

I freely admit that the whole fic side of fandom was new to me when I joined XMMFF back in August 2000. I was used to discussion newsgroups and basically knew one person when I started posting my fic there. I have never been involved in any 'clique' or anything in X-fandom, but I have discussed the fandom and its vagaries ad nauseum with many other fans over the past two years (I've got a jones for meta. I admit it).

My impression comes mainly from reviews of my own (and other movieverse writers') stories on FF.net, reading the X-Fan message boards, and talking to other movieverse writers, not all of whom are L/R (hi Min). And there does seem to be a lot conflation of movieverse with L/R, as in "all movieverse is L/R" (with its attendant corollary, 'and all L/R is crap') in those places.

And now I'm just rambling.

Need caffeine.